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Jan 23, 2007

And Then There Were Two

(5:43 EST --Completely re-written for coherence)


Given the MSM's quadrennial confiscation of America's electoral process, The BAG offers you the first axiomatic image of Campaign '08.  The photo, accompanying Sunday's NYT  snap-shot of Clinton's entrance, and effect, on the Democratic race, has everything pretty much figured out.

The message?  First, that Richardson, Edwards, Dodd, Kucinich, Vilsack, Biden, Clark, Kerry, Sharpton and Gore needn't bother.  Second, that in the only fight that really matters (did I mention the article title? -- Clinton Enters ’08 Field, Fueling Race for Money), Hillary (in the silver and pearls) nails down the bling-bling.

... So, any predictions on 2012?

(image: Evan Vucci/Associated Press. published: January 21, 2007.


Looks to me like hillary is looking to blow obama - just what we need, another sex scandal in the white house...

But frankly, I would rather have a president lie about blowjobs than steal elections and launch wars of conquest based on lies.

If it is true that hillary is lusting for obama, then the "clenis" must have lost some of its "magic."

Where the heck do you find that, charlie tuna?

And, hold on! Hil may get the money but will she get the votes?

yeah, I don't see that either. maybe tuna needs a cold shower.

to me, this image captures a sense of Obama as the sly and eager youngster, and Clinton as the cold but forebearant adult. also, a reminder that they're not so much at odds that they won't speak to one another. an interesting and nuanced image.

It's the pearls.

Her husband's baby-batter and its projection was subject of World conversation. She should never wear pearls. Pears are so above the common person anyhow. She looks really good in silver, like she wore in the intro (previous post).

These two are such a positive sight after the past decade of helmet-haired-curmudgeon-zombie dominance in our images.

Looks like a spirit of COOPERATION to me. He's talking, she's listening (for now) and they are both leaning into what appears to be some soft spoken statements.

Hillary / Obama '08

Please don't condescend by providing dictionary links to words you use. It's insulting.

My first impression was that here are two [outside] candidates sitting together. My second impression was that he is not intimidated by her. He's leaning in, chatting comfortably with a hint of relaxed wry humor. She leaning in, listening, looking very polished and coiffed, but almost cold, controlled? Makes me wonder how they work together. And then, how they come across to potential donors. It will be very interesting.

Axiomatic? How?

Tiffany model? Because she's wearing a bracelet, a watch and two earrings?

2012? But the 2008 fun has barely begun!

In reading this post, I'm reminded of the statement I heard a couple months back: “Cynicism is not a sophisticated response.”

I find the photo attractive. Hillary is looking forward yet listening thoughtfully, if somewhat wryly, as Barack leans in and shares a seemingly witty comment. Their camaraderie and respect for one another is palpable.

I also thought of Obama as looking young and eager. I don't know about Hillary... It sort of looks like she's trying to pay attention to whatever she's looking at, while he wants to tell her something - like when you're watching a movie with a friend and she make comments the whole time. You don't want to tell her to shut up, so you kind of nod and smile while trying to hear the movie.

Lillian Smith and Eldridge Cleaver must be smiling in heaven...the white woman and the black man...the great myth...desire and understanding for one another as the "oppressed." What a lovely(sic) late 1960's fantasy of a ticket: white woman, president; black man, vice-president.

He's addressing the person sitting to Hillary's right.

I agree with Aunt Deb. Otherwise Hillary looks too abstracted from whatever Obama is saying.

I saw this on the NYTimes website, and what struck me is that heading up an article that was ostensibly about Hillary's entry to the field, there was a pic giving Obama half the visual play.

This was supposed to be Hillary's early moment in the sun. I imagine the Hillary people saw this and said, "What the f--- do we have to do to overshadow this guy!?!"

I think it is a warm and lovely shot, of two smart people talking. He is saying something he is excited about; she is doing him the courtesy of thinking deeply about it. Their heads are inclined inward at the same angle. It looks nice. Not everything has to be awful and cynically manipulated.

Sorry, I think my comments here were too obscure (as was the title, which I changed). My point was simply that the MSM already has the race narrowed to Clinton and Obama (with the additional implication that Hillary is most likely to secure the most early "big donor" support).

The first few comments posted show exactly what is going to happen if Hillary gets nominated. Constant puerile sex talk about the Clinton fling(s), stupid suggestions about is she zooming her veep, etc. etc.

Putting aside smears about Obama's attending a madrassah (Juan Cole clears it all up on his blog for those who don't get it), the one thing that can be legitimately thrown at him is his almost total imexperience. This disturbs me also. Toss in the outed and closet racists of the country and we have our #2 unelectable candidate.

Personally, I find constant comments about his physical appearance a way of further trivializing him, playing up that women are attracted to him and that's mostly what he's got going for him. I, for one, do not really find him all that drop dead gorgeous (my previous comment about his beach--worthy body notwithstanding), I mean he's not exactly Denzel Washington, is he? But it's being said over and over again. He's not ugly at all, but c'mon. I think the "young'n handsome" thing is not really flattering him, just another way of pointing out that he's too wet behind the ears to be President.

John Edwards in '08. If Obama is so wonderful let him shoot for a later election, let him get some years under his belt in the Senate first. It won't hurt and it won't be that long. And Hillary--no, no, no. No.

The Democrats can take this election with one hand tied behind their back the way things are going, but I fear they will find a way to screw it up. Sigh.

An experienced hand, and an eager beaver.

What we really need is someone who is really good at rebuilding a reputation.

The president of 2008 will have to wind us out of Bush's war and find some way to rebuild a shattered economy, and world opinion of the USA that is at a very low point. They are going to have a very tough job.

Frankly, I wouldn't wish that mess on anyone. I'm honestly surprised to see so many who want the job - it will not be an easy presidency by any means.

I would like Obama to wait til 2012. I think his spirit of optimism and positive energy will suit us well then. But I don't see much hope for this country until then, at the earliest. We're in for some very rough years.

"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."
-Douglas Adams

Obama is in her "space." Hilary can't look at him because he is so close. But I think that she is paying close attention to what he is saying. Hilary is sharp and she is in control.

Why does Bag-Man talk about 2012? Is he conceding 2008 to McCain?

Hilary down in flames in 2008, and Obama as President in 2012? I think yes.

I agree with Aunt Deb. Otherwise Hillary looks too abstracted from whatever Obama is saying.

tina: Okay, McDreamy he isn't, but compared to Hastert, Cheney, Emanuel, Frank, Kucinich, et al., Obama is pretty good looking. I agree all this talk is just a way to infantilize him and point out that he is inexperienced. But his inexperience is a factor that he will have to overcome. I heard someone (forgot who) say that he is a blank slate because of his lack of experience and lack of exposure to many of the electorate, so that a voter could super-impose almost anything on him without contradiction. That is also part of the problem for him. As he becomes more well-known, opinions will be stronger for/against him. From what I've seen of him he seems much too smart not to know that, which leads me to wonder if he is in this for some other reason. One that occurred to me is to force the issues for the democrats further to the left. IOW, to bring Hillary more to the left of center. [Hope this doesn't sound to 'out there.']

While a Clinton/Obama ticket may be the dream for you and me and democrats on the left, I think it scares the hell out of all those racist misogynists out there in the hinterlands. Following up to Donna's point, I think the country would welcome some comfortable candidates with solid experience, perhaps Gore/Clinton or Gore/Edwards. As a people, we don't like radical change. We like to feel comfortable with our leaders and if the democrats can come up with a slate that makes us confident that we will weather the coming storm, perhaps they will have a chance.

BTW, I think this is an excellent photo of the two of them and I think they are interacting. Clinton is keeping a keen eye on whatever else is going on, but young and eager Obama is devoting all his attention to his elder. And in the Senate, seniority matters.

Also, WTF is that faucet handle doing in the right corner????

He's not really looking at her, is he? I can see why she would be looking straight ahead, since to make eye contact at that distance would be too weird. I'll buy that he is indeed talking to her, but unless he is focused on that stray lock of hair over her eyebrow he is looking past her at something or someone else.

Maybe it's just how a photo taken in one millisecond of time can be misleading, but I get the sense of two very self-conscious, very self-focused people who are always checking out where everyone else in the room is in relation to themselves.

truthseeker: I think it's a stemmed water glass waiting for use. They (Hill & Barry) were probably brought to the table, the photographers have their way with them, and then the meal/event begins.

tina: yes, there will be more stupid comments about sex because of the stupid behavior of our 42nd, her husband. It's going to be a lot more intense than a few comments in the Bag. The union she has with her husband is now a life long symbol of infidelity. The comments may seem stupid, but we all had to endure the blue dress, it's history, a part of our lives. I admire her courage to wade through it.

She supported tire burning as a source of energy for a NY paper plant.
She's got more issues, other than an errant hojo, to overcome.

... So, any thoughts on 2012?

After last night? Webb.

Conversation over the dinner table with my fundamentalist Christian family last night (something I can rarely stomach, but they had guests):

"Bill does it, and Hillary does it too, she just hasn't been caught yet. I'm sure she's as big a louse as he is".

"All Muslims are not terrorists, but all terrorists are Muslims. That Obama person is one of them".

That folks, is all you need to know about the rural heartland mentality. They don't care what the truth is. They think that Bush's proposal to tax health insurance is actually going to get them more money back on their taxes, and they don't see the larger impact it will have in terms of gutting health care for the middle class by forcing employers to reduce benefits. As long as they can get $50 more back on their tax return, THEY DO NOT CARE.

They are living from paycheck to paycheck. They go to Wal Mart once a week to buy supplies and they make the minimum possible credit payments, mostly on mortgages and credit cards. That's all they can do. They cannot imagine anything else any more, because they are concentrating so hard on how to keep their economic balancing act going. They know they are one minor emergency away from foreclosure on their meagre assets. Yet they continue to want to think of themselves as a priviledged class.

People become radicalized when in this state of uncertainity and fear, and this group of people--and they are a huge group nationwide and they all vote--have radicalized by turning to religion and adopting a classic fascistic/authoritarian mindset. They are paranoid and hate the government but somehow think Bush is on their side and in opposition to the government. My sister keeps a framed picture of Bush next to her children's photos.

I was almost punched in the face by my brother last night for suggesting he was not, perhaps, literally protected by an angel when he got involved in a minor car wreck. His wife intervened and he instead started slamming his fist down furiously on the dining room table. My mother then started shrieking about how God had performed a miracle because she lost her Bible while on a "mission trip" but later found it in her suitcase. She had gone to an orphanage in Nairobi and seen children dying of AIDS, children with nothing, with no future, she saw them with her own eyes, and YET she sincerely believes that there is a God who does literal miracles and chooses to do them to restore the luggage of white middle class American church ladies, but not to save even one life of a child in an African orphanage. That's her God, that's what she worships.

In other words, these people are on the edge emotionally, project blame for their problems onto others, and act out their rage/frustration. They are superstitious in ways it is hard to imagine, and additonally they have a moral/ethical screw loose somewhere.

Yeah and they all have guns, too. Lotsa guns. Don't even talk about trying to take away their guns. They insist that Miami has become "the safest place in the world since Jeb Bush was elected governor".

Think they will ever vote for a Clinton/Obama ticket?

The Democrats could get their vote by offering them a $100 bill and a ban on abortion, maybe--if the candidate offering same is a white male.

Yeah, I know you are thinking right now, who needs the vote of these loons? Just remember they elected Bush twice. The Democrats need to realize they are driven by very real fears, and they need to find a way to address these fears while offering an alternative to their panicked, hate-filled lives, something that actually appeals to them. People like my family members have no imagination any more, if someone could fire that up by offering some kind of hope, a vision they could understand that could not be derided as "socialism", they might stop voting against their own self-interest, which is what they are doing now.

Don't ask me how to do that, if I knew how I'd be doing it. All I know is they will vote for a Hitler/Stalin ticket before they will vote for Clinton/Obama; Clinton is too well known and Obama is not known well enough. That is not to dismiss the gender/race issue, which is very real for them.

Democrats they respect: Gen. Wesley Clark and Jim Webb--both almost solely on their military associations. They are looking for someone like that to follow right now, someone who comes across as "tough". Edwards looks enough like a televangelist that they might warm up to him.

True, we will not sway all red staters that way, but we do need to sway some of them to win the White House in 08. Some of the more thoughtful ones might jump over to the Dems if the candidate is right. For this, Clinton and Obama are wrong.

Just my two cents.

re: Study in contrast

Last night, FOX News's Brian Wilson commented on the major color among lady's outfits, to know: purple. Brit Hume interjected that, after asking her earlier in the day, Pelosi had intended to wear a 'sea foam green' outfit, but then spilled chocolate on it, hence the sea-foam jacket.

I have always liked Hillary and I have always thought that she would make a good President. But I never thought her to be "electable". After all the Republicans have been "swiftboating" Hillary way before we even knew what "swiftboating" was. I thought that the GOP and the GOP radio talk show guys and gals have given Hillary so much crap over the years that they made her unelectable. But just recently I feel different about that. The GOP, Bush and the conservative rats on the radio have all lost credibility. So now I think Hillary is truly electable. What do you think of Obama for Vice President?

KansasKowboy--see my post above.

tina: finger on the pulse. The recent poll on the news today showed Hillary with something like 94% recognition factor, highest of all. But likeability factor was way down to 50-something%, which means she has a LOT to overcome. And that's just what people say in public, privacy of voting booth is something else. I hate to say it but Hillary and/or Obama in any combination will loose the dems the election. And this from someone who voted for BOTH McGovern and Eugene McCarthy!

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